[LAU] OT: SSD disk prices have dropped?

[Ivan K]

I need to replace a hard drive that recently
went bad, and the new drive needs to be at
least 1TB.  I was looking on Amazon and
debating whether to buy a 5400rpm versus 7200rpm disk,
when, just for fun, I thought I would price
1TB SSD disks.  I started finding things
such as this:


https://www.amazon.com/Inland-Professional-Internal-Solid-State/dp/B07FM9SSP6/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1542239578&sr=8-6&keywords=ssd+hard+drive+1TB+sata
Inland Professional 1TB SSD 3D NAND SATA III 6Gb/s 2.5" 7mm Internal Solid State Drive (1T)
$140 (USD)


https://www.amazon.com/Samsung-Inch-Internal-MZ-76E1T0B-AM/dp/B078DPCY3T/ref=sr_1_3?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1542239031&sr=1-3&keywords=ssd+hard+drive+1TB
Samsung 860 EVO 1TB 2.5 Inch SATA III Internal SSD (MZ-76E1T0B/AM)
$148 (USD)


Can I just plug one of these drivex into a SATA plug
on my motherboard and it will function just like
a regular spinning hard disk drive?

If 1TB SSD drives have become so cheap, I don't
understand why anyone would buy a hard drive that
spins anymore, but maybe I am missing something.

Am I missing anything?

[David Kastrup]

Post by Ivan K
I need to replace a hard drive that recently
went bad, and the new drive needs to be at
least 1TB.  I was looking on Amazon and
debating whether to buy a 5400rpm versus 7200rpm disk,
when, just for fun, I thought I would price
1TB SSD disks.  I started finding things
https://www.amazon.com/Inland-Professional-Internal-Solid-State/dp/B07FM9SSP6/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1542239578&sr=8-6&keywords=ssd+hard+drive+1TB+sata
Inland Professional 1TB SSD 3D NAND SATA III 6Gb/s 2.5" 7mm Internal Solid State Drive (1T)
$140 (USD)

[...]

You read the bad reviews? Looks like a bait-and-switch and the newer
drives have no RAM cache whatsoever, greatly reducing access speeds.

Post by Ivan K
If 1TB SSD drives have become so cheap, I don't
understand why anyone would buy a hard drive that
spins anymore, but maybe I am missing something.
Am I missing anything?

When the bad reviews are consistent, they may be relevant even if they
are outnumbered by the good reviews.

[David W. Jones]

Post by Ivan K

Post by Ivan K
I need to replace a hard drive that recently
went bad, and the new drive needs to be at
least 1TB.  I was looking on Amazon and
debating whether to buy a 5400rpm versus 7200rpm disk,
when, just for fun, I thought I would price
1TB SSD disks.  I started finding things

https://www.amazon.com/Inland-Professional-Internal-Solid-State/dp/B07FM9SSP6/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1542239578&sr=8-6&keywords=ssd+hard+drive+1TB+sata

Post by Ivan K
Inland Professional 1TB SSD 3D NAND SATA III 6Gb/s 2.5" 7mm Internal
Solid State Drive (1T)
$140 (USD)

[...]
You read the bad reviews? Looks like a bait-and-switch and the newer
drives have no RAM cache whatsoever, greatly reducing access speeds.

Post by Ivan K
If 1TB SSD drives have become so cheap, I don't
understand why anyone would buy a hard drive that
spins anymore, but maybe I am missing something.
Am I missing anything?

When the bad reviews are consistent, they may be relevant even if they
are outnumbered by the good reviews.

We have Samsung EVO SSDs (500gb) in our laptops. Very highly rated and excellent performers. Well worth the sales price we got them at a couple of years ago.

--
David W. Jones
***@hawaii.rr.com
authenticity, honesty, community
http://dancingtreefrog.com

Sent from my Android device with F/LOSS K-9 Mail.

[Ivan K]

Yes, the Inland does have bad reviews.

I see that Samsung makes _two_ different 1TB SSDdrives, with quite a bit of price differencebetween them:https://www.amazon.com/Samsung-Inch-Internal-MZ-76E1T0B-AM/dp/B078DPCY3T/ref=sr_1_2_acs_ac_2?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1542243162&sr=1-2-acs&keywords=Samsung+EVO+SSDSamsung 860 EVO 1TB 2.5 Inch SATA III Internal SSD (MZ-76E1T0B/AM)$148MZ-76E1T0B/AMhttps://www.amazon.com/Samsung-2-5-Inch-Internal-MZ-75E1T0B-AM/dp/B00OBRFFAS/ref=sr_1_2_acs_ac_3?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1542243162&sr=1-2-acs&keywords=Samsung+EVO+SSDSamsung 850 EVO 1TB 2.5-Inch SATA III Internal SSD (MZ-75E1T0B/AM)MZ-75E1T0B/AM$335though in reading the specs as they are displayed onAmazon, I am not sure what you have getting for theextra money for the MZ-75E1T0B.And that $335 is quite a bit price difference froma $50 1TB 5200rpm disk.

[Ivan K]

The Yahoo interface really messed up my last post.  Let me
try again.

Yes, the Inland does have bad reviews.

I see that Samsung makes _two_ different 1TB SSD
drives, with quite a bit of price difference
between them:

https://www.amazon.com/Samsung-Inch-Internal-MZ-76E1T0B-AM/dp/B078DPCY3T/ref=sr_1_2_acs_ac_2?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1542243162&sr=1-2-acs&keywords=Samsung+EVO+SSD
Samsung 860 EVO 1TB 2.5 Inch SATA III Internal SSD (MZ-76E1T0B/AM)
$148

https://www.amazon.com/Samsung-2-5-Inch-Internal-MZ-75E1T0B-AM/dp/B00OBRFFAS/ref=sr_1_2_acs_ac_3?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1542243162&sr=1-2-acs&keywords=Samsung+EVO+SSD
Samsung 850 EVO 1TB 2.5-Inch SATA III Internal SSD (MZ-75E1T0B/AM)
$335

though in reading the specs as they are displayed on
Amazon, I am not sure what you have getting for the
extra money for the MZ-75E1T0B.

Anyone know?

And that $335 is quite a bit price

[David W. Jones]

Post by Ivan K
The Yahoo interface really messed up my last post.  Let me
try again.
Yes, the Inland does have bad reviews.
I see that Samsung makes _two_ different 1TB SSD
drives, with quite a bit of price difference
https://www.amazon.com/Samsung-Inch-Internal-MZ-76E1T0B-AM/dp/B078DPCY3T/ref=sr_1_2_acs_ac_2?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1542243162&sr=1-2-acs&keywords=Samsung+EVO+SSD
Samsung 860 EVO 1TB 2.5 Inch SATA III Internal SSD (MZ-76E1T0B/AM)
$148
https://www.amazon.com/Samsung-2-5-Inch-Internal-MZ-75E1T0B-AM/dp/B00OBRFFAS/ref=sr_1_2_acs_ac_3?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1542243162&sr=1-2-acs&keywords=Samsung+EVO+SSD
Samsung 850 EVO 1TB 2.5-Inch SATA III Internal SSD (MZ-75E1T0B/AM)
$335
though in reading the specs as they are displayed on
Amazon, I am not sure what you have getting for the
extra money for the MZ-75E1T0B.
Anyone know?
And that $335 is quite a bit price

We have the 850 EVO 500GB, bought before or around the time the 860 came out. We paid ~$120US each.

That $335 for an 850 is because the 850 was replaced with the 860 line.

I think PCWorld review rated the 860 line as much faster than the 850.

I'd take the 1TB EVO 860 for $148.

--
David W. Jones
***@hawaii.rr.com
authenticity, honesty, community
http://dancingtreefrog.com

Sent from my Android device with F/LOSS K-9 Mail.

[Roger]

Post by David W. Jones
We have the 850 EVO 500GB, bought before or around the time the 860 came out. We paid ~$120US each.

I have the same SSD, it works well. Bought for ~$AU220 several years ago
and has been 100% reliable.

Post by David W. Jones
That $335 for an 850 is because the 850 was replaced with the 860 line.

Whatever the reason, it's not worth that much money.

Post by David W. Jones
I think PCWorld review rated the 860 line as much faster than the 850.

IIRC they are both similar in speed but the 860 has a longer life
expectancy. This site shows the 860 EVO is 1% faster -
https://ssd.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Samsung-850-Evo-1TB-vs-Samsung-860-Evo-1TB/3576vsm423831

Post by David W. Jones
I'd take the 1TB EVO 860 for $148.

That's cheaper than the listed used ones. Absolute bargain if it's legit.

I have had HDDs fail to write fast enough when recording over 30 tracks
simultaneously. Never an issue with SSD.


Cheers

Roger

[David W. Jones]

Post by Ivan K
Yes, the Inland does have bad reviews.
I see that Samsung makes _two_ different 1TB SSDdrives, with quite a
bit of price differencebetween
them:https://www.amazon.com/Samsung-Inch-Internal-MZ-76E1T0B-AM/dp/B078DPCY3T/ref=sr_1_2_acs_ac_2?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1542243162&sr=1-2-acs&keywords=Samsung+EVO+SSDSamsung
860 EVO 1TB 2.5 Inch SATA III Internal SSD
(MZ-76E1T0B/AM)$148MZ-76E1T0B/AMhttps://www.amazon.com/Samsung-2-5-Inch-Internal-MZ-75E1T0B-AM/dp/B00OBRFFAS/ref=sr_1_2_acs_ac_3?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1542243162&sr=1-2-acs&keywords=Samsung+EVO+SSDSamsung
850 EVO 1TB 2.5-Inch SATA III Internal SSD
(MZ-75E1T0B/AM)MZ-75E1T0B/AM$335though in reading the specs as they
are displayed onAmazon, I am not sure what you have getting for
theextra money for the MZ-75E1T0B.And that $335 is quite a bit price
difference froma $50 1TB 5200rpm disk.

The $148 860 drive is the one to focus on. The speed difference between that $50 spinning disk and an SSD is phenomenal.


--
David W. Jones
***@hawaii.rr.com
authenticity, honesty, community
http://dancingtreefrog.com

Sent from my Android device with F/LOSS K-9 Mail.

[Ralf Mardorf]

Hi,

as internal drives I'm using SSDs only, for backups I'm using external
HDDs.

I'm using 3 Toshiba OCZ SSDs, probably those are the cheapest and
slowest, but "slowest" still means super fast. Proprietary software for
Toshiba OCZ is available, e.g. by the Arch user repository.

The software I'm using to update firmware and to get better
information, than provided by smatrctl:
https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/ocz-ssd-utility/

Software that is available, but that isn't used by me:
https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/oczclout/
https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/ocztoolbox/

Formatted Capacity Power-On Hours Count Host Writes Lifetime remaining
OCZ TR200 240GB 25.07.2018 42,00840 € x 1,19 = 49,99 € 223,57 GiB 2256 83049 92%
OCZ TL100 240GB 27.07.2017 72,68908 € x 1,19 = 86,50 € 223,57 GiB 8909 73515 86%
OCZ TL100 240GB 03.02.2017 65,50420 € x 1,19 = 77,95 € 223,57 GiB 11789 278459 65%

I'm using periodic TRIM once a week.

[***@archlinux ~]$ systemctl status fstrim.timer | tail -1
Nov 11 19:22:04 archlinux systemd[1]: Started Discard unused blocks once a week.

There are no issues when using ext4 and recent Linux installs, such as
e.g. Arch Linux or Ubuntu 16.04. Running Windows 7 in a virtual machine
using qcow on ext4 works fine, too.

I experienced hiccups with unsupported antique Linux installs.

All you need to do is replacing a HDD by a SSD, power and SATA plugs are the
same. Assumed your SSD does support TRIM, you should enable periodic TRIM.

$ sudo hdparm -I /dev/sdc | grep -i trim\ support
* Data Set Management TRIM supported (limit 8 blocks)

Regards,
Ralf

[Ralf Mardorf]

Post by David W. Jones
The speed difference between that $50 spinning disk and an SSD is
phenomenal.

It is and nobody should worry about "greatly reduced access speeds",
if the SSD has got no cache. With the SSDs I mentioned, I can turn on
the computer and use the display manager's greeter to log in after
around 2 seconds. IOW I can already start a user session, while some
startup processes, such as establishing an Internet connection, aren't
done. The reported startup time is around 7 or 8 seconds, however, I can
log in after around 2 seconds. Even the slowest SSD is way faster, than
the fastest HDD. IOW the disk never will be the bottleneck again.
"Greatly reduced access speeds" without cache are a vague claim. This
is "reduced access speed" nearly nobody could notice, at least not if
you migrate from a HDD to such a SSD and neither for averaged desktop
work, nor for real-time audio work.

[David Kastrup]

Post by Ralf Mardorf

Post by David W. Jones
The speed difference between that $50 spinning disk and an SSD is
phenomenal.

It is and nobody should worry about "greatly reduced access speeds",
if the SSD has got no cache. With the SSDs I mentioned, I can turn on
the computer and use the display manager's greeter to log in after
around 2 seconds.

And your SSD does not have an internal cache? Are you sure about that?

Post by Ralf Mardorf
This is "reduced access speed" nearly nobody could notice, at least
not if you migrate from a HDD to such a SSD and neither for averaged
desktop work, nor for real-time audio work.

Real-time audio work does not mind disks braking transfer speeds to
Flash speeds, including the pauses for wear management, internal
allocation, block erasure?

I've been caught out flat a lot fantasizing about how I'd wanted to
imagine computing to be. I would recommend some restraint distributing
advice on that base.

[Ralf Mardorf]

Post by David Kastrup

Post by Ralf Mardorf

Post by David W. Jones
The speed difference between that $50 spinning disk and an SSD is
phenomenal.

It is and nobody should worry about "greatly reduced access speeds",
if the SSD has got no cache. With the SSDs I mentioned, I can turn on
the computer and use the display manager's greeter to log in after
around 2 seconds.

And your SSD does not have an internal cache? Are you sure about that?

Hi,

via a link provided by https://ssd.toshiba-memory.com/en-amer/ssd/tr200:

" The SSD does not use a DRAM cache, instead it uses a chunk of its
NAND cells and invokes an SLC written cache to speed up the majority of
writes." -
https://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/toshiba-tr200-ssd-960gb-review,5.html

Post by David Kastrup

Post by Ralf Mardorf
This is "reduced access speed" nearly nobody could notice, at least
not if you migrate from a HDD to such a SSD and neither for averaged
desktop work, nor for real-time audio work.

Real-time audio work does not mind disks braking transfer speeds to
Flash speeds, including the pauses for wear management, internal
allocation, block erasure?

HDDs do have internal management routines, too. Apart from a damaged
HDD, I never experienced a HDD, let alone a SSD, as a bottleneck when
doing real-time audio work. For everything I'm using HDDs and SSDs, I
either don't notice a different performance, since HDDs are already fast
enough, e.g. for real-time audio usage or SSDs are noticeable faster
than HDDs, e.g. when launching bloatware.

Post by David Kastrup
I've been caught out flat a lot fantasizing about how I'd wanted to
imagine computing to be. I would recommend some restraint distributing
advice on that base.

On what SSD experiences do you base your recommendation?

I dropped all HDDs for Linux real-time audio, since the SSDs are silent
and I'm using an iPAD for real-time audio. Those are my experiences
with SSDs. I'm not aware that any issue I experienced with a recent
Linux install or my iPad was caused by a SSD and would have not happened
when using a HDD. For backups I'm using external HDDs, since they are
less expensive and because I don't know how safe a SSD is, when used as
a backup drive.

I don't know if the OP does expect a scientific investigation. I
mentioned my experiences, named the used SSDs and provided information
such as "host writes".

Regards,
Ralf